Happy in Thailand

By : MarcHolt
Views : 421

I was totting up the years the other day and I was astounded to realize I’ve lived here almost 30 years. Amazing! I only came here for a one-week holiday. Despite all those years since I still feel like I’m on holiday.

Living here can be very comfortable, provided you take some basic precautions. Maybe what works for me is not for you. But I offer my own experiences here and you can be the judge.

Jai yen yen – Keep a cool heart – Mai pen rai

Almost one of the first phrases I learned when I came here was jai yen yen. It means to keep a cool heart, or don’t be hot headed. Yeah, I was a hotheaded young fella when I arrived. We come from a society that expects perfection. Jobs must be done on time, and they must be done well. Not so in Thailand. I wanted everything done as fast and efficiently as we did it back home. So I often heard jai yen yen from my Thai colleagues.

You can still do the job well, but do it at a Thai pace. It will get done with a lot less stress.

Here, it’s important to enjoy whatever you are doing. If it’s not Sanuk (good fun) Thais will quickly lose interest. They also rely on a close-knit group of friends at work to support them. This can mean that ‘face’ comes into the equation as well. Somchai is not going to do a job so well that he makes his other friends look bad. It’s important to care about the other people in your group.

This caused me problems many years ago when I was technical manager at a large computer company. I had a team of twelve technicians and programmers working under me. I would hand out work assignments and give them a deadline for completion. Invariably, the assignments were either incomplete or not even started.

When I dug into the reasons for this I realized that even though I was nominally in charge of the team, the real leader was the chief programmer. He led the team and made the decisions on what was to be done. If he decided that an assignment I had handed out was not as important as something he was working on, my assignment was pushed to the rear. I soon learned to work closely with him and ask him to help me make decisions and assign them to the team. If I had not already learned jai yen yen. I would have not been able to resolve the problem. It’s very easy to let ego get in the way, instead of cooling down and working the Thai way.

One excellent way to build up good relations with your staff is to bring some kanom (sweets) for them occasionally, especially if you have been away traveling. If you go overseas, bring them a treat from the country you visited. If you go upcountry, buy them a bunch of Thai kanom.

You don’t have to do this every day. But if your staff have done a good job, you can bring them some kanom, or even better take them out to dinner somewhere. Of course, you pick up the tab at the end of the evening.

You must walk a fine line though. You can’t be over friendly. They are not your equals. You are the boss and must act like one. But at the same time you can’t be overbearing. By bringing them kanom, or treating them to a meal for a job well done you gain a lot of face and they will respect you. Respect is very important to them. Step over the line and lose it, and you may well find it impossible to continue working with them.

Like offices the world over, you should also avoid an office romance. You will lose face, you will find that your staff do not respond any more, and you will certainly have trouble with the girl you have an affair with. One of you will have to leave the company eventually. Guess who that will be.

Face

This brings me to the Face concept. Every Thai has face. But what is face, exactly?

Basically, it is the self-esteem Thais hold themselves in. Destroy that self-esteem somehow and you will make an instant enemy. You may not even know you have done it if you are not careful. When dealing with Thais, always be careful to maintain their dignity. If you have an issue with someone at the office, take them aside and have it out with them in private. Don’t berate them in front of their colleagues.

And remember that you also have face to the Thais. This is why you always need to maintain a certain dignity. Yes, you can laugh and joke with people who are socially ‘inferior’ to them, but never lower your guard or they will take advantage of you. This is where a lot of farung have problems. If you know a Thai very well and one day they come to you with a sob story and ask for money, be firm and polite, but say No.

If you give in, you immediately lose face, because they know you are a sucker and they can take advantage of you. The only Thais you should ever help are close family members, and only then if you have a high position in the family. Since my wife’s father died, I am the senior male in the family. Her mother is still in charge, but I am the one they look to if there is ever a real problem that requires the family to help with.

So far, in the eight years we have been married, I have only been asked twice to help a family member. My cousin had a serious medical problem that needed urgent treatment. Her father, my brother in law, asked if I could loan him the money for the operation and he would repay me within one week. Of course, I helped them. And true to his word he repaid the money.

The second time was with my wife’s next oldest sister, a lazy and dare I say it, stupid girl. She had borrowed 15,000 Baht from a moneylender five years ago. She had been paying a usurious interest every month ever since then without being able to repay the original loan.

I agonized over this request with my wife. We discussed the many problems the sister had created for herself. The loan business was just one in a long string. In the end we decided not to help her. If we had, she would have done something else equally stupid and asked for more money because she would have seen my help as a loss of face for me. Instead, we told her to leave the job and get away from the moneylender. She had more than repaid him with the interest she had been paying.

But she refused, saying that she liked her job and didn’t want to leave her friends. What can you say to someone like that? She is still paying interest now, more than two years later.

Buddha is always with you

Thais believe the only perfect thing in the universe is Buddha. And he is always with them.

Have you ever noticed how bus drivers sit on the side of their seat squashed up against the side of the bus? That’s so that they can leave room for Buddha to sit beside them. When you realize that, it’s a bit worrying isn’t it? After all, it really means they are not confident about their driving ability and expect Buddha to guide them. Kind of like that woman who let go of the steering wheel in the US and cried out for Jesus to guide her car…just before she had a major crash.

This attitude towards perfection carries over into all Thai life. Nothing is ever done to perfection. It would be an insult to the Buddha.


This is especially evident in the construction industry. You hear stories from foreigners all the time. They come here to build a dream home for their retirement. But invariably the tiles are laid wrong, the wiring is a mess, walls are not straight, window frames have gaps between the wall and frame. The list is endless. An extreme example of this was one chap who ordered a home in Phuket. He gave the builder the plans, and then he was called back home for three months. When he returned the house structure was almost finished. He was impressed. At least, he was impressed until he walked inside. At first, he couldn’t put his finger on what was wrong. Then he realized that the builder had read the plans upside down. His house had been built back to front!

But he has lived here long enough to know there was no sense in getting angry. He just shrugged and worked with what he had. He had to move windows and some inner walls to achieve something livable. Mai pen rai.

Noise and pollution

Westerners coming here for the first time are often amazed at the noise and pollution. How can you live here, they ask.

The answer is simple. Do what the Thais do. Look for the beauty around you and ignore the ugly.

Living in Thailand comfortably

Officials: The biggest headache you will face here will be your dealings with officials, especially immigration police. Remember that these people have the power to allow you to stay, or they can kick you out; depending on how you interact with them. No matter what they demand, and how inconvenient it is for you, keep smiling, do exactly what they ask, and always be polite.

Soon after I arrived here I made the mistake of antagonizing my immigration officer. I received a message from my secretary to go and see him. This was on the last day of preparations for the first ever business exhibition at the new Australian Embassy. Needless to say, I was extremely busy. I told my secretary to tell him I would go and see him the next day. Nothing more was said.

I arrived the next day. He had a big grin on his face. “Give me your passport.”

I handed it over and he pulled out a huge stamp and banged, “Visa Cancelled” on the page. Then he looked at me and told me that next time he called he expected me to arrive on the same day. He gave me 24 hours to get out of Thailand and apply for a new visa. You don’t make that mistake twice.

Next time I saw him I took a bottle of JW Black, and gave him a deep Wai. He looked after me very well after that.

Work and Home: You don’t have to ‘go native’ as some people try to do. You can live very well here as long as you keep your relations with those around you on an even keel. Whenever something goes wrong, and it will, getting angry will only make a bad situation worse. Learn to control your emotions and you will do much better.

Angry at something? Don’t blow up. Wait until you are out of sight of any Thais and let off steam. Thais sometimes do it by kicking a dog. I don’t recommend that. But you can beat the hell out of your pillow. Or go out for a drink and a good whine with a farung friend. After you have got it out of your system you will be ready to face life until the next crisis.

When my brother was up here a few years ago we had a small problem. I don’t even remember what it was any more. But I do remember his reaction. He got angry. I kept my cool and resolved the problem. Afterwards, he turned to me and paid me what I consider the greatest compliment he has ever given me, “Marc, you are very Thai.”

When people start saying that to you, you know you have finally got a handle on living in Thailand.

 

2007 © Marc Holt. All rights reserved by the author.


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Comments / Feedback

Dana
October 27, 2007, 11:56

“Marc, you are very Thai.”

"When people start saying that to you, you know you have finally got a handle on living in Thailand."

No, when people start saying that to you it is time to get you and your family out of Thailand: something Mr. Holt and his family are doing now. Many reasoned and clever words will be offered for this Holt family exodus both here and in Thailand and in the next country of their domicile but the jet stream of the departing plane with family aboard will be the final writ that people remember.

Mr. Holt has chosen a topic of sure fired popularity. The only subject that will routinely gather more comments is the subject of Sin Sot. Whether the Thai culture has value and whether Thai character should be taken seriously is the constant coursing blood of expat and tourist complaint, and observation, and conversation. And in true testosterone fashion all the participants quickly choose sides and take up the war cry. On one side of the line will be the non Thais who insist that they 'love' Thailand and that everyone who does not love Thailand is a monster. There are 191 countries in the world and Thailand is the best one. Silly. On the other side of the line will be individuals looking for a more balanced view by insisting that some negatives be given attention. And outshouting everyone will be the expats who use their greater number of days in the Kingdom to trump every argument by saying:

"I've been here longer. I've eaten more **** sandwiches. Everyone listen to me."

People look back in history and wonder sometimes where wars came from. Look no further than this above example. Everyone is right and other viewpoints are wrong. Etc.

My contempt for Thais and Thai culture is seamless and constant. No better example than this quote from Mr. Holt:

"One excellent way to build up good relations with your staff is to bring some kanom (sweets) for them occasionally, especially if you have been away traveling."

I don't want to know people individually or culturally like this. Mr. Holt is correct that this type of behavior is necessary in interfacing with Thais, but knowledge of necessary behavior should not automatically translate into respect for that behavior. In Psychology this is called identifying with your oppressor; something that sometimes happens with kidnap victims of long capture.

In discussions of Thais and Thai culture invariably you can substitute the words dogs or children and the sentences still make sense. I don't find this charming. Apparently, I wish more for the Thais than they wish for themselves. This does not make me a Thai hater. It makes me a person who has pity for Thailand. Hate is a strong emotion. Thailand does not deserve strong emotions.

I predict this subject will engender a lengthy thread of comments easily and quickly separated into two groups. The expats and the politically correct will shout that they 'love' Thailand and that any other response is ignorant and wrong and totally without merit. Others will offer up more balanced views of a complicated subject. Oh that's right, I already said that. See how quickly the subject gets boring?

This has all been done before. Opinions differ. When I lived in the Caribbean any conflict with a native would earn the response from the native: "I born here." This intellectual cul de sac was the natives response to reasoned debate or possibly interesting conversation. Case closed and subject over: I Born Here. Children and not interesting children either. Same same Thailand.
Bill
October 27, 2007, 18:38

Nice Marc, liked it. ‘Mai pen rai’ and ‘Face’ are linked very closely together in Thailand.

Dana, ‘In Psychology this is called identifying with your oppressor;’

Okay, Let’s talk Psychology:

Cultural Relative: ‘The view that one cannot judge behaviour properly unless it is viewed in the context from which it originates.’

Different cultures have different constructions of behaviour and so interpretations may and do differ across cultures. A lack of this ‘cultural relativism’ can lead to ETHNOCENTRISM.

Ethnocentrism: ‘A belief that one’s own ethnic or cultural is more important than other ethnic or cultural groups.’

I guess most of us at one time or another has been guilty, (if not only a tiny bit) and could hold our hand up to one, or even both of the above thought patterns. I know I can or at least have done in the past. It’s easy to jump to conclusions; some Thai individuals are guilty of this and of course, so are many non Thai individuals. Now reading Dana’s comment I’m not suggesting for a minute he is guilty of such viewpoints. No, I wouldn’t dare make any comments that may imply this, never, God forbid. Dana is of course a fine upstanding example of a rational thinking, level-headed present day American citizen whose viewpoint can never been accused of making absolute statements about what is right and what is wrong with regards to human behaviour and in particular the cultural norms of which certain individuals have adopted. After all, if he had, that it would involve ‘pots and kettles’.
chuckwoww
October 27, 2007, 20:51

You covered it well there Dana but what you're saying can be summed up in a few words I think...once a farang, always a farang. I suppose there are exceptions, luk krung for instance, or those born to Thai parents outside of Thailand. They live in a special kind of limbo. The best adjusted farang I meet are those who just accept being farang.
chuckwoww
October 27, 2007, 21:31

Additional thought after reading Bill's comment....I'm not sure why Dana would feel 'contempt' for the ethnocentric Thais. Is it really that important? Or is it because Dana comes from a country of immigrants where everybody is supposed to 'just get along'?
Dana
October 27, 2007, 21:48

"Cultural Relative: ‘The view that one cannot judge behaviour properly unless it is viewed in the context from which it originates.’ "

Yes, thank you Mr. Bill for obfuscating simple ideas with typical liberal silliness. You might be stunned and flabbergasted to find that there are prisons in Thailand. Apparently, not all Thai behavior is 'relative'; not even to the Thais.

Additionally, I would like to float a fly of an idea on the surface of your brain: who says Ethnocentrism is improper or leads to erroneous conclusions? Is it you? Isn't that ethnocentric? If you buy into ethnocentrism you have swallowed something you can not spit up again. Say hello to your own intellectual error.

When I was young and ignorant I also knew everything. And one of the things I 'knew' was that the 19th century behavior of the British in their colonies regarding how they interacted with the locals and what judgements they made about the locals character was wrong, wrong, wrong. Now that I am older and am less ignorant I am not so sure I feel comfortable with this blanket politically correct condemning of the British in their colonies in the 19th century.

A local wife smiles at a another man and she is burned alive? How much time do we need to waste considering the 'cultural context'? You tell me. Are there no limits? Are there no universally accepted norms of human behavior? If we manage to stumble across a society that finds throwing babies from spear point to spear point a fun activity am I supposed to be understanding? Hey, Mr. Bill--how about being a little less ethnocentric yourself and consider the baby. I'm guessing the baby does not appreciate being thrown from spear point to spear point. Just me. Are we going to spiral down this politically correct social apologist intellectual drainpipe until some fool points out that Hitler had a mother and was probably misunderstood and we should not be too judgemental until we examine his behavior within the context of his life?

Think I am being extreme? Really? Well, opinions can differ. I am more and more persuaded that throwing the 'context' argument over ever kind of behavior is extreme. If someone comes into my house and shoots my daughter I am not going to be interested in hearing social theory. I am going to be interested in killing the bastard. I offer up that thought and action as normal and acceptable and universal.

Farang apologists for Thai filth and squalor and stupidity and predictable childish violence are thick as fleas on a soi dog on the net. They get to practice moral superiority just by typing. An easier victory it would be hard to imagine. Why we eulogize and romanticize and mythologize these people is an enduring mystery to me. Behavior you would not find acceptable in your family or in your neighborhood you defend when you are on vacation.

Think I am being unfair? Ok, let's stop in any local Thai bar in Essan and randomly pick out some individuals. You can do the picking. We will make these people your social and business contacts for the rest of your life. They will be your surgeons, and food inspectors, and pilots. How do you feel now about 'context' without rules of any kind? Social relativity does not work. There have to be some lines in the sand and we can start with rudeness. In the West one of the ideas that children are taught is to 'treat others the way you would like to be treated'. I would like to believe that something so simple is universal. It isn't. If I am in Asia and some local is being rude to me that is not the time for social theory. That person is just being rude and my judgement that he is being rude is not misplaced on my part.

Products of venal, stupid, ignorant cultures often fail to qualify as interesting or reliable companions. Recognition of this fact should not label the indentifier as a bad person. In the United States many graduating High School seniors make an obligatory trip overseas. The overwhelming percentage of them never go back to the countries they visited. Any idea why Mr. Bill?

People should not be pilloried for powers of discrimination and a desire to retain dignity. The notion that all people are really equal if we can just understand the 'social context' of their actions and thoughts is not an idea that is supported by the facts. The first lesson of travel is that people are different. And different does not automatically also mean of equal value. If I am walking down the street and I see a ten dollar bill and a one hundred dollar bill on the sidewalk and I can only pick up one bill: I am going to pick up the one hundred dollar bill. Not everything is equal and everyone of my discriminations in life should not require defending.

In the future (and the now) Thais and Thailand are going to either by choice or default be involved in global market and global social interfacing. They will be found wanting and uncompetitive. This will of course be blamed on others like myself who are not hip enough to know that rudeness is Thai and so too special and exotic for me to appreciate. I sometimes wonder if closer inspection of British behavior and experiences in the colonies in the 19th century would cause me to apologize to them. I sure was smart when I was young. I knew everything. Now, I am not so sure.
a bloody yank
October 28, 2007, 05:22

I believe this to be one of the better "getting by in Thailand" guides I have ever read.
Please keep them coming. My hope is your actually leaving LOS is an idle threat.
After all Marc, What are you going to do then? Write about life in Adelaide?
Cheers, And again, thank you
Marc Holt
October 28, 2007, 14:10

Thanks to the Yank. What will I write about? That is a question I have been pondering too. But I am sure I will be writing. But from a different perspective...perhaps a story or two on how my Thai family adjust, and certainly one on how I adjust after 30 years away. To say I have reservations is an understatement.

Dana touches on some very interesting points. However, I hope he wasn't accusing me of being an apologist for the bad things in Thailand. One of the reasons I have been able to stay here so long is that I have always remembered who and what I am. I am merely a visitor here and never could have been anything else. But while visiting, I have also learned Thai ways so that I can fit in enough to make everyone comfortable. That doesn't mean I condone everything they do either.

The Thais are rapidly finding that they are the odd ones out in the international scene. Will they change? I doubt it. But I do think some major changes to Thai society are just around the corner...one of the reasons for getting out.

But mostly, I am leaving for personal reasons. I've lived through 5 coups already. I doubt the Thais could throw much else at me that I couldn't handle.

I think Dana makes some valid judgments, but they are colored by his own cultural perspective. And let's not forget why he comes to Thailand. It isn't to study Thai culture, unless you count horizontal dancing as a Thai cultural activity!
Union Hill
October 28, 2007, 15:18

I think Marc got this pretty much spot on. Although I have not lived in Thailand as long as he has, I can relate to his points concerning jai yen-yen, face, corruption and pollution. My own experiences have been remarkably similar. I didn’t see a need to psychoanalyse this.

Some us are here by choice, some by accident, some of us are trapped here and some of us simply have nowhere else to go. But generally, we are all free to leave anytime we choose. Any expat living in Thailand has to deal with the locals and once your life starts to get entwined with the fabric of Thai society, you have no choice but to abide by Thai rules. Your business, your property, your family all bind you to this culture. Sure, there are many things that stick in the craw but we (expats) have no influence in bringing about change however much we would like to. The choice for us is a simple one, do we put up with it and stay, or do we go?

Inspite of all its idiosyncrasies, I still enjoy living in Thailand. I still appreciate and enjoy the things that attracted me to Thailand in the first place. I have no plans to leave.

My guess is that wherever Marc and his family decide to re-settle it will take them an entire generation to fully reintegrate into their new home. Wherever he goes, his children and probably his wife will suffer a culture shock of their own.
Bill
October 28, 2007, 18:30

Dana, thanks for pointing that out to me. Although I’m not exactly sure what your point is, as I openly stated in my earlier comment, I too have been guilty of the before mentioned ‘isms’. And not wishing to sound rude, but yes I use to have the same nonsense line of thought as you on this subject. This is mainly because I too use to drone on labouring every point to saturation complemented by witless trivial nonsense.

To get back to the submission, Marc with his vast amount of knowledge and experience has written a very informative piece here and I simply just didn’t feel it deserved or warranted your earlier comments. Sorry if my words upset you in any way, you needn’t feel threatened by me.
Dana
October 28, 2007, 19:39

"And let's not forget why he comes to Thailand. It isn't to study Thai culture, unless you count horizontal dancing as a Thai cultural activity!"

Why else would one go to Thailand? To ride an elephant? Cooking school? Ok, maybe; but not in my case. I go to Thailand to participate in 'horizontal dancing'. Marc is correct and I do not think he meant that remark in a mean spirited way but it does illustrate something that has irritated me for years.

One of the criticisms of men who go to Thailand to participate in 'horizontal dancing' is that they are not interfacing with the real Thailand. Really? I've got news for you. It isn't necrophilia I am engaged in; the girls are actually living breathing Thais with goals and dreams and needs and the ability to talk and move and respond and listen. Yes, that's right; women who make a living by exchanging sex for money are human beings. They are Thai human beings and I am participating in the culture of Thailand when I am spending time with them. Do they represent top to bottom the entire culture of a country? Of course not; but they do represent themselves and their culture. It all counts.

The tourist from Estonia who spends two weeks on tour taking photos and riding elephants and learning to cook with spice and bargaining for silk shirts at the Jim Thompson house did not participate in more of Thailand than I did. In fact, the chances are overwhelming that he did not actually participate in 'Thailand' at all because all he did was buy and look and take pictures. I've done all of those things. I have done them repeatedly because I am an enthusiastic tourist and I have done them geographically in much of Thailand. But I do not believe that they educated me about the real Thailand more than the girls I have spent time with either short time or long time. When you take off your clothes and act like adults and talk either before or after you are suddenly way past taking a picture of a temple and bragging back home to your Estonian friends that you saw the 'real' Thailand.

The women in the sex for money business do not represent all of a society. But they are Thai and the experiences do count. It all counts. A tourist who went to seminar at a Thai University, and then toured the Emporium with an educated guide, and then visited a luncheon at the Thai embassy, and then did watercolor paintings of Soi Duthep at sunrise, and then did the cross over into Burma in the Golden Triangle saw Thailand differently. Do they know more about the real Thailand than somebody who is chatting up, and listening to, and making love with Thai women on a daily basis? I doubt it. No, I don't believe it. I think the chances are that I am actually interfacing with Thailand in a more intimate way. What do you suppose teaches you more about a person and a culture: taking a picture of them or holding them in your arms?

I love it when tourists pontificate on the net about how they went some place foreign to them and participated in the real Swaziland, or the real Pago Pago, or the real highlands of New Guinea, or the real China, or the real France. Really? How many of the people in these countries did they hold in their arms? How many of these people in these countries did they talk to in the middle of the night? How many of the people in these countries did they buy gifts for because the resulting smile will fill them with happiness? How many of the people in these countries did they take showers with in a non sexual way--the intimacy of adults that can not be replicated by riding an elephant or walking in the rain holding a mulberry bark umbrella. I do not participate in the real Thailand when I am spending time with Thai women horizontal dancing? That is ignorant and insulting to the wonderful Thai women who decide to spend a part of their Thai lives with me.

It all counts.


chuckwoww
October 28, 2007, 23:14

Dana and Bill between them seem to have dealt with the main points without any help from me. Personality disorders aside the thing that always baffles me about these discussions is why Thai imperfections bother some Westerners so much. Why let them get under your skin or try to change them? Sure they can be rude and irritating but so can farang.
Marc Holt
October 29, 2007, 10:45

Once again, Dana has made a valid point. The interaction he has with Thais during his horizontal dancing lessons are certainly one way to learn something about Thais and Thailand. But it can hardly be instructive in the wider sense. The only way to really understand a people and their culture is to immerse yourself in them. (I am going to refrain from the obvious puns here!)

Moving back to Australia is going to make me go through culture shock again, although I don´t think it will be too difficult to adjust. But I sure will miss a lot of the things we take for granted here in Thailand. I guess you will have to wait to read about my reactions to my fellow countrymen when I get back there.
Dana
October 29, 2007, 18:03

"Once again, Dana has made a valid point. The interaction he has with Thais during his horizontal dancing lessons are certainly one way to learn something about Thais and Thailand. But it can hardly be instructive in the wider sense. The only way to really understand a people and their culture is to immerse yourself in them."

Nobody would disagree with this and most (or all) would agree that the only way to immerse yourself effectively in a culture is to become language fluent in that culture. Since 99.99% of all non Thai visitors to the Kingdom are not going to become Thai language fluent it follows that mechanically it is impossible for them to immerse themselves in the culture with accuracy regardless of intent or jai dee. So why don't we give these guys a break. They can never become Thai culture knowledgeable and that is not a marker of negative character, just a fact. It's ok to be a tourist. And it is also ok on the part of the expats and the politically correct to be just a little bit less judgemental.
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